Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney is facing difficulties with some evangelical voters in Iowa who are troubled by his Mormon faith, which they consider not part of historic orthodox Christianity.
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(Photo: AP Images / Charlie Neibergall)Republican Presidential hopeful, former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney speaks to local residents, Friday, Nov. 30, 2007, at Kirkwood Community College in Cedar Rapids, Iowa.
Although the former Massachusetts governor is still leading the pack in the important early voting state, a fellow Republican and former Baptist preacher is closing in from behind, benefiting from voters’ dilemma with Mormonism.
Former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee’s rise in Iowa has been fueled by evangelical Christians attracted to his conservative views and openness about the role of faith in his life.
In a new ad running in Iowa, Huckabee declares “faith doesn’t just influence me, it really defines me.”
On the other hand, Romney has refrained from addressing how his Mormon faith will influence his public duty despite intense curiosity by voters.
He has been able to garner evangelical support, as he did in South Carolina, but evangelicals in Iowa seem more uncomfortable with Romney’s Mormon beliefs compared to fellow believers in other states.
“Mormons spend two years of their lives as missionaries, preaching an anti-Christian doctrine,” said Iowa resident and Huckabee volunteer Barbara Heki, 51, according to the New York Times. “I don’t want someone out there, if I can help it, who’s going to be acting on an anti-Christian faith as the basis of their decision making.”
Most poll respondents, however, are more reluctant to admit their bias against Mormonism.
A New York Times/CBS News poll in November of likely Iowa caucusgoers found that among evangelicals, 36 percent favored Huckabee and 22 percent Romney, even though respondents said in nearly equal numbers that both candidates share the values of most Iowans.
The poll also found that about two-thirds of Huckabee’s supporters are evangelicals, compared with about one-third of Romney’s.
“I’m concerned a lot of Christians are thinking about the values issues and forgetting about the creator behind the values issues,” said Glenda Gherkey at a Huckabee event in Iowa, according to the New York Times. “I guess I feel like this country and this world needs a president who would be able to pray to the God of the Bible and he would be able to hear his prayers.”
Gherkey then wondered out loud if Romney’s prayer would “even get through.”
Although Huckabee said he did not want to speak for or bad-mouth any other candidates, the former governor said, “My views are what they are. I don’t think I’ve ever hidden where they come from.”
The Southern Baptist Convention, the denomination which Huckabee belongs to, does not consider Mormons to be part of historic Christianity.
“I’m glad you’ve made your choice for me. I don’t care why. I’m just glad you did,” Huckabee joked.
In an Iowa straw poll last August, Huckabee, still unknown to many at the time, came in a surprising strong second-place behind Romney. The former Arkansas governor also came in a narrow second behind Romney at the Washington Values Voter Summit in October.
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Apollo...
Why you putting Colorado on your list? Mormons only make up 2% of the religious right in Colorado, whereas 38% are Christian. Nevada 12% vs 35%, New Mexico 4% vs 35%. I couldn't find actual statistics for Oregon but it does appear to be predominately Mormon. Washington 2% vs 29%. And I didn't even include Catholics in the numbers.
So, other than Utah, I dont know where all this "support" is coming from.
Bigotry is alive and doing far too well, especially among Republicans. Keep pushing to get rid of Mormons and you will soon find yourselves all alone on the 'religious right' ... Catholics are leaving, you can't afford to have Mormons leave, too. yes, Mitt needs evangelicals to win the presidency, but the Huckster can not win without Mormons (in Nevada, New Mexico, Oregon, Colorado, Arizona and even Idaho, Washington and Utah). You don't think that Mormons will vote for a Democrat? Harry Reid, the Demoncratic leader in the Senate is a Mormon and divides the Mormon vote. Provo, Utah (home to Brigham Young University) had a demoncratic congressman for most of the 1990's. And now that they have all been called members of Jonestown by Huckabees supporters in advertising, phone calls, mailers, etc. They will show their Christianity by turning their cheeks (you can guess which cheeks I am describing) and vote in another direction, libertarian, third party and moderate democrat.
Good luck, Huckster and your bigoted friends!
My ancestors came to America on the Mayflower to pursue religious freedom. My ancestors were pushed out of Mass. into Rhode Island because of religious freedom and my ancestors left the United States of America (my great great grandmother walked from Far West, Missouri to the Great Salt Lake valley which was then part of Mexico) to avoid rapists, murderers, a and a governor's extermination order to pursue religious freedom. We have been a longtime ally in the fight of the religious right (look at our fight against Roe, look what those justices had to say about Mormons! Look to what Mormons and Catholics did in Nevada for constitutional amendment of marriage)...If you don't want our help, we will no longer break bread with you.
I will never vote for a bigot. Jesse Jackson would sooner vote for David Duke than I would vote for Mr. Huckabee. The Huckster is just as big of a bigot as Mr. Duke.
Evidently, Romney is not even a good Mormon. Here's info I saw elsewhere:
For information on Mitt's problems check out what people from Mass has to say:
http://massresistance.org/romney/
Included is a 28-page comprehensive report released in November describing how Gov. Romney ran for office and governed as a liberal, despite his claims to the contrary.
Articles include:
How Mitt Romney brought "gay marriage" to Massachusetts
Report on the true pro-life views of Gov. Romney
Romney's universal health care includes taxpayer-funded abortions
Romney's Department of Social Services (DSS) honored two "married" men as their "Adoptive Parents of the Year"
While he was Governor, Romney donated $10,000 to radical homosexual "health" group
Letter from 44 conservative leaders across the country to Gov. Mitt Romney - Hand-delivered in December 2006; urged Romney to act to undo his mistakes on "gay" marriage before leaving office. Letter was ignored.
Letter from Mitt Romney to Massachusetts Log Cabin Republicans - While running for US Senate against Ted Kennedy Mitt made big promises to the homosexual lobby.
VIDEO of Romney debating Ted Kennedy in 1994 - Romney arguing that he's more liberal than Ted Kennedy!
Example of Governor's Commission on Gay and Lesbian Youth activities - Your tax dollars at work, under Romney's control.
Romney timeline on "gay" marriage - Here's what happened and when.
VIDEO of Romney disavowing any connection to pro-life movement - during 2002 campaign for Governor.
VIDEO of Romney passionately defending his pro-choice position - during 2002 campaign for Governor.
Here is Romney's speech, if you would like to read it:
http://www.mittromney.com/News/Speeches/Faith_In_America
Here is a good story:
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/opinion/orl-newvoices0507dec05,0,804997.story
In reference to Joseph Smith...
"For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ.And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve."
What? you dont think that Satan knows the scriptures? he knows them better than we do, and he's intelligent enough to insert just enough "truth" (i.e. scripture) to make it sound good, but it is misleading.
"Ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth? This persuasion cometh not of him that calleth you. A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump." Galatians 5:7-9. Don't you realize that a little lie in a truth makes that truth a complete lie? And a little truth in a big lie is just as bad.
Sure, Joseph's fruits were completely contrary to the word of God. I guess if that is the case, then the scripture below is false.
Mosiah 3:17 -
And moreover, I say unto you, that there shall be no other name given nor any other way nor means whereby salvation can come unto the children of men, only in and through the name of Christ, the Lord Omnipotent.
Cartoon banned by the Mormon church
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zy0d1HbItOo
"""If a prophet does not proclaim God's will and His word, both written and by revelation, he is not a prophet. That is the definition of the word "prophet". """
This is true -- and this also proves that Joseph Smith was no prophet of God, but was a false prophet. For his teachings did NOT proclaim God's will and His Word; instead they were completely contrary to them.
It's not a skewed view if you read the Bible. Every single prophet in the Bible received revelations from God. That is what a prophet does. A prophet tells us what God wants us to hear. The whole Bible exists because of revelation. Without revelation, the people perish (Prov. 29:18).
A prophet does not call himself to the position of a prophet (Heb. 5:4). God calls a prophet to serve Him. A prophet does not do what he wants to do with his time, he does what God asks him to do. A prophet does not speak what he wants to speak, he speaks what God wants him to speak. Prophets are the Lord's chosen servants, called, chosen, and ordained to do His work, not their own. And He doesn't leave them high and dry. God gives them a work to do. That is what revelation is; God speaks to His prophets, and gives them their job, and tells them what to prophesy, what to preach. They are not their own teachers; they are the Lord's teachers. Revelation is crucial to the calling of a prophet, in any age. Here are a few examples: (Gen. 41:39; Deut. 8:3; Matt. 4:4; D&C 98:11; 1 Sam. 3:1; 1 Kgs. 19:12; Job 33:14; Dan. 2:45; Matt. 7:7; Matt. 11:27; John 10:4, 14:21, 15:15, 16:13, 17:8; 1 Cor. 12:3, 14:6; 2 Cor. 12:1; Gal. 1:12, 2:2; Eph. 1:17, 3:3; James 1:5; 2 Pet. 1:18; Rev. 1:1, 4:1; 1 Ne. 4:18; 1 Ne. 16:9; 2 Ne. 27:7; 2 Ne. 27:11; 2 Ne. 28:30; 2 Ne. 32:5; Enos 1:5; Jarom 1:4; Omni 1:25; Alma 5:46, 17:3; Hel. 5:30; Morm. 8:34, 9:7; Ether 3:25, 3:27; Moro. 7:37, 10:4).
geez...what a skewed view of a prophet. What..they just sit around on their thumbs waiting for some glorious revelation? NOT! That's only a minute part of it...especially after the New Testament
If they don't receive revelation from God, then they aren't prophets.
but you didnt answer my question.
Joseph Smith was God's spokesman on earth. "Whether by my own voice, or by the the voice of my servants, it is the same" (D&c 1:38).
If a prophet does not proclaim God's will and His word, both written and by revelation, he is not a prophet. That is the definition of the word "prophet". They speak with God, and receive His will directly, not just by middlemen.
by the way...who said the these prophets i know don't speak the will of God? you made that assumption from one sentence? how immature.
hess...
Joseph wasn't a true prophet either. At least not a prophet of God. Prophets dont speak anything contrary to the Word of God
Then your prophets are not true prophets, because God speaks his will through His prophets (2 Peter 1:21). They don't just read books.
hes...
i know lots of prophets. and none of them claim what Joe did. All the prophets i know speak the ONLY Word of God (the Bible). Everything they speak is weighed by the scriptures and by the prophets.
If God hadn't called prophets and apostles, we would not have the Bible today. For it was through prophets and apostles that God revealed His word, and they wrote it down. Joseph Smith was a prophet of God, who testified of our Savior and Redeemer, Jesus Christ.
mormons are smithian's. We are Christians b/c we follow only Christ. mormons follow joseph smith.
Yes, we are Christian. We believe in Jesus Christ and His teachings. Not you, or anyone else, will ever be able to take that away from us.
Let me just say this to every mormon. through these last few days and many posts, you have just reaffirmed that mormonism is NOT Christianity!! I repeat mormonism is NOT Christianity!! Thank you all so very much for enlighting us on true darkness of mormonism. We truly do love every mormon, just like every jew, muslim, hindu, buddaist, etc. etc. We just want the veil that Satan has placed upon your eyes to be removed and the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob reveal himself to you through the true Jesus, Jesus Christ of the Bible.
I'm glad Romney is going to address this issue, and I hope he is honest about the huge differences between Mormonism and Biblical Christianity.
Romans 6:23
"For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." Sin is earned...eternal life is a gift.
James 2:
14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
Good night and God Bless.
The gospel of Christ is very simple, it is all about Him. There is NOTHING you can do to earn salvation. All you have to do is open His Gift. There verses below are very clear.
Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"
Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
Romans 5:8 "But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."
Romans 10:9-11 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed."
12"For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."
Ephesians 2:8-9
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Galatians 2:20-21
20I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
Yes, how will we hear the word without a preacher? And where does that preacher come from? God reveals His will through his chosen preachers, those he has given His authority to preach the gospel, and administer in the ordinances thereof. No one takes this office by themself. They must be called of God (Heb. 5:4).
Hokey...
I agree with you for the most part, but the truth remains that we will always sin. Our flesh cannot be saved. And there will always be a battle. But i do believe that there is a difference between sinning...and practicing sin. I believe we will always sin, but I believe we can cease from practicing sin.
As many times as we sin, God will forgive us if we repent. That is the mercy and love of God and His gospel. Of course we do not premeditate sinning in the future. If we do that, that too is sin. When we repent, it is to forsake the sin permanently. But if we fall short, or make a mistake, Christ is not going to abandon us. We can still repent.
The process of sanctification is one of continual repentance. It changes our heart and soul. It changes our dispositions and desires. We become like the people of king Benjamin when they shouted, "Yea, we believe all the words which thou hast spoken unto us; and also, we know of their surety and truth, because of the Spirit of the Lord Omnipotent, which has wrought a mighty change in us, or in our hearts, that we have no more disposition to do evil, but to do good continually" (Mosiah 5:2).
You are right. The correct attitude that we must always have is the same attitude that Nephi had, and that is "I will go and do the things the Lord hath commanded" (1 Nephi 3:7).
Thanks for the quotes from President Kimball. I love the prophets of the Lord.
servent, your posts are great, thanks. Keep it up. Mormons aren't going to hear the true until Christians speak the truth.
Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
Have you reached this place of abhorrence of sin? Doesn't this sound impossible to you yet, Hesadanza?
Miracle of Forgiveness, Spencer Kimball, pp. 354-355
“ What kind of repentance merits forgiveness? Alma 13:11-12 indicates an attitude which is basic to the sanctification we should all be seeking, and thus to the repentance which merits forgiveness, It is that the former transgressor must have reached a ‘point of no return’ to sin wherein there is not merely a renunciation but also a deep abhorrence of the sin- where the sin becomes most distasteful ti him and where the desire or urge to sin is cleared out of his life.”
(Miracle of Forgiveness, Spencer Kimball’ Ch. 12, pp. 163-165)
An army officer called a soldier to him and ordered him to take a message to another officer. The soldier saluted and said, ‘I’ll try, sir! I’ll try!” to this the officer responded:’ I don’t want you to try, I want you to deliver this message.’ The soldier, somewhat embarrassed, now replied: ‘I’ll do the best I can, sir.’ At this the officer, now disgusted, rejoined with some vigor: ‘I don’t want you to try and I don’t want you to ‘do the best you can.’ I want you to deliver this message.’ Now the young soldier, straightening to his full height, approached the matter magnificently, as he thought, when he saluted again and said: ‘I’ll do it or die, sir.’ To this the now irate officer responded: ‘I don’t want you to die, and I don’t want you to merely do the best you can do, and I don’t want you to try. Now, the request is a reasonable one; the message is important; the distance is not far; you are able-bodied; you can do what you have been ordered. Now get out of here and accomplish your mission.’ It is normal for children to try. They fall and get up numerous times before they can be certain of their footing. But adults who have gone through these learning periods must determine what they will do, then proceed to do it. To ’try’ is weak. To ‘do the best Ican’ is not strong. We must always do better than we can…”
hokey, check out the sidebar page
Abandonment of Sin
Doctrine and Covenants 58:43 “There is one crucial test of repentance. This is abandonment of the sin. Desire is not sufficient. In other words, it is not real repentance until one has abandoned the error of his ways and started a new path… The saving power does not extend to him who merely tries to abandon sin.”
How many times can you repent?
We must strive to forsake sin and live all the commandments. But we will fall short. That is why we have our Savior, Jesus Christ. His sacrifice and atonement make it possible for us to be forgiven when we fall short.
Satan's plan in the pre-mortal life was for us all to be required to be absolutely perfect in this MORTAL life, and therefore we would all be saved. Not one would be lost. We would all be denied our agency, one of the greatest gifts of God, in order for this to happen. There would be no sin because Satan would not allow it to even happen, whatsoever. Kind of a communist ideology. In other words, no need for a Savior. It was an utterly gross and evil plan.
But we know that we accepted God's plan, with the gift of his Son, Jesus Christ, as a Savior, because we are here today. Those that agreed with Satan were cast out with him, and never will have the privilege of obtaining a body. They lost their first estate.
God gives us our agency to sin, if WE choose to sin, or if WE fall short because of the flesh, because WE have our free agency to do so. But God does not condone it, he does not allow any sins, and we are commanded to repent if we do sin, and Christ's atonement will redeem us.
Again when is his grace sufficient.
1. After denying ourselves of All ungodliness.
2. After doing ALL we can do.
According to Moroni 10:32 and 2 Nephi 25:23.
As an example: If you tell your children, "You may have dessert AFTER you finish your vegetables," when do they get dessert?
So God's grace doesn't come until AFTER All we can do and AFTER denying ourselves of all ungodliness.
"Abandonment of Sin: The forsaking of sin must be a permanent one. True repentance does not permit making the same mistake again." (LDS pamphlet, "Repentance Brings Forgiveness.")
"2. There are no sins that God allows. If we want to sin, we have our agency to do so, if we so please. But He does not condone it. And He commands us to repent if we do sin, and he will forgive us."
"Forsake the sin and not REPEAT it."
Doesn't that mean that you can't commit the same sin more than once and still expect his grace to be sufficient?
Grace is sufficient to save me, if I strive to do all that I can do to obey God.
1. God can not condone sin, not in the least.
2. There are no sins that God allows. If we want to sin, we have our agency to do so, if we so please. But He does not condone it. And He commands us to repent if we do sin, and he will forgive us.
"Forsake the sin and not REPEAT it."
"Live all the commandments of the Lord."
Sounds like you only get one time to repent.
Five Steps to True Repentance by LDS prophet Spencer W. Kimball “…remember that to obtain forgiveness from the Lord and his church one must: 1) Realize the seriousness of the sin and pray in great humility ans sorrow. 2) Forsake the sin and not repeat it. 3) Confess the sin to the bishop or other church authority . 4) Restore as far as possible that which was damaged. 5) Live all the commandments of the Lord. (LDS pamphlet, “Repentance brings Forgiveness”.)
But you have told me you are not doing so yourself. So is his grace sufficient for you? Not according to Moroni 10:32 and Nephi 25:23.
Doctrine and Covenants 1:31-33 “For I the Lord cannot look upon sin with the least degree of allowance; Nevertheless, he that repents and does the commandments of the Lord shall be forgiven; And he that repents not, from him shall be taken even the light which he has received; for my Spirit shall not always strive with man, saith the Lord of Hosts.”
Hesadanza
1. What does it mean when it says, "I cannot look upon sin in the least degree of allowance?
2. What sins will He allow?
servent,
I don't type, I hunt and pick, might I suggest posting on one of these and come back later and post them here.
http://www.christianpost.com/article/20071125/30217_Sidebar:_The_Bible_vs._Mormon_Beliefs.htm
http://www.christianpost.com/article/20071204/30330_Romney_to_Gamble_Votes_with_Mormon_Speech.htm
Thanks for your help.
Daily striving to do our best and keep God's commandments is not impossible, Hokey. You can do it.
Hesadanza,
Doesn't this sound impossible?
I quote myself, "We strive to do 'all we can do.' I strive every day to do better. Do you?"
Eventually we will be able to fulfill God's law perfectly, but it will not be while we are still mortal. In the meantime, God has asked that we do "all we can do", which is doing our best. One of God's commandments is that we repent, and call on His name forevermore.
1. If you have not repented of your sins, you are still "in" them, and Christ's sacrifice cannot have any efficacy in your life.
2. If you repent, then you are not "in" them anymore. Christ washes them away.
3. Through the Atonement of Jesus Christ, his blood redeems us from our sin when we do what He has asked us to do, including repenting and obeying His commandments.
hokey,
please let me know when you're done, I've got several things I want to bring up. thnx