A first grade class took a school-sponsored trip to a gay wedding last week, drawing heavy criticism from pro-family conservatives.
According to reports, 18 first graders, ages five and six, traveled to San Francisco City Hall Friday for the wedding of their teacher and her lesbian partner, demonstrating what some see as a real consequence of the California Supreme Court's decision to legal same- sex “marriage.”
"Taking children out of school for a same-sex wedding is not customary education. This is promoting same- sex marriage and indoctrinating young kids," said Yes on 8 and ProtectMarriage.com Campaign Co-Manager Frank Schubert in a released statement.
"I doubt the school has ever taken kids on a field trip to a traditional wedding," Schubert added.
Liz Jaroslow, the school’s interim director, told The San Francisco Chronicle that the field trip was "a teachable moment," and said she believes the field trip was justified academically.
"I think I'm well within the parameters," she said.
Officials in other school districts, however, disagree.
Santa Ana Unified School District board member Rosemarie "Rosie" Avila told ProtectMarriage.com that teaching kids whether gay “marriage” is okay or not should not be up to public schools but “is an issue for parents to discuss with their children according to their own values and beliefs.”
“It shouldn't be forced on us against our will," Avila added.
The wedding on Friday was officiated by San Francisco Mayor Gavin Newsom, a “friend of a friend,” who is featured in a recently released Yes on 8 television ad. In the ad, Newsom declares that the door to same-sex “marriage” is “wide open now” and that “[i]t's gonna happen, whether you like it or not.”
The Yes on 8 campaign explains that if the voters do not overturn the California Supreme Court's same-sex “marriage” ruling by voting for Proposition 8 next month, teachers will be required to teach young children that there is no difference between gay “marriage” and traditional marriage.
“This is overt indoctrination of children who are too young to understand it," said Chip White, press secretary for Yes on 8, regarding the news of last week’s contested field trip.
According to the Chronicle, 6-year-old Nolan Alexander said Friday that marriage is "people falling in love."
It means, he added, "You stay with someone the rest of your life."
Since same-sex “marriage” became legal in California in mid-June, at least 11,000 couples have exchanged vows statewide, according to the Williams Institute for Sexual Orientation Law and Public Policy based at the University of California, Los Angeles.
And since news spread last week that Proposition 8's supporters had far outraised its opponents and the measure was gaining support in public opinion polls, more gay couples from around California and the nation have been feverishly tying the knot ahead of Election Day to avoid missing out if voters approve Proposition 8, which would amend the state constitution to limit marriage to between a man and a woman.
If approved, the ballot initiative would overturn a California Supreme Court ruling that made the state only the second, after Massachusetts, to legalize same-sex “marriage.” On Friday, the Supreme Court of Connecticut ruled the state would be the third to allow gay “marriage.”
RSS
I wonder if anyone thought about the fact that all the students had an approval to go to the wedding from their parents. Maybe some of you continue to see gays and lesbians as "other" but the realtiy is their parents gave their OK. Two of the kids did not go because they can opt out which they did. Tell me what is so bad about celebrating a teachers wedding. Would there be a fuss if she married a man?
Robert, you come to this forum late in the game. I have posted countless studies, but I will repost if necessary. I would like you to counter post with some studies, if you'd be so kind.
Mike, I would love it if you could cite an actual study. Surely someone as outspoken as yourself on this subject would have a whole stack at the ready.
I'm also curious if anyone knows what happened to my earlier post.
Correct, they're not black and white, which is why you can't make a statement such as DP that all gays are codependent or have come from traumatized backgrounds. There are plenty of straight people like that as well.
mike22685, I have read the testimonies of homosexuals some who are still practicing and some who have left the homosexual lifestyle and many not all are struggling with codependency issues and many came from some pretty messed up backgrounds especially in the area of sexuality and others came from backgrounds which for the most part appeared to be relatively normal, whatever that might be preceived to be. Once again all issues in this area are not black and white.
Daniel Paul, your pastor's information is out of date and not scientifically related at all. That would be like your pastor saying acne comes from eating french fries, we used to think it, now we have learned more. Homosexuality is not a choice, and it is not a mental condition that can just be prayed away. My father is an excellent man, and I have 2 straight brothers and a straight sister. I know plenty of gay men with the same case. There simply is no research to back your ideas, and you certainly cannot go around saying all gay men are codependent. That is a loaded diagnosis, and one which you are not qualified to make.
Mike,
I'm not trying to stalk your posts. Nor am I trying to jump down your throat. You and I have a disagreement on what you said. So to avoid that in the future, I will try to keep track of what you say when.
liar: one who lies or spreads lies....
Sounds right to me. Just FYI, I don't turn people in unless they are being 'dangerous' somehow like threats and stuff. One of the basic rights from God is for each person to believe what they choose to believe. The responsibility that goes with it is being judged based on what you believe. Mike and everyone else has the right to believe whatever they want. We're here to discuss it.
"unless you are a psychologist, you do not have the authority to tell everyone that gays are codependent. "
You're arguement presupposes I am not quoting a psycologist of psyciatrist. My has been written on the subject by people with good qualifications and it doesn't agree with what you have been saying.
Our pastor was explaining in part of his sermon on Sunday that homosexuality in males was caused by lack of a healthy physical relationship with the dad. In the 60's and 70's many believed that dad's being too physical with their sons would make their son's gay. It's quite the opposite. He said gay men are looking to fill that void left by their own dads. This psycology also applies in some heterosexual situations as well with girls wanting the physical affection they didn't get from their dad's and boys wanting that relationship they didn't have with their moms.
That would be wonderful, thank you. I don't have enough people on here to stalk my posts for the first chance to jump down my throat.
ok Mike, I will begin to try to keep track of what you say, so you can be shown your own words in the future.
I did not call him a liar, I said that he was spreading lies as if he was an authority on the matter, which he is not, hence, he is lying. To call someone a liar when it is the truth is not name calling or being offensive.
No, you called him a liar. You changed it on the repost to say "It is a lie", which while offensive is not as offensive as directly calling someone a liar. That is why I did not flag you the third time.
WB, I reported CP but did not say who did it. I did not ever call him a liar, I said he was lying rather than sharing the truth. To say all gays are codependent is a lie, and unless you have studied the ins and outs of codependency issues, I don't think you are qualified to discuss them either. You are now personally attacking me rather than sticking to the topics. You didn't flag me because I was offensive, you flagged me because you didn't like what I had to say.
You call people liars and do not like it when you get flagged. And you complain to CP for someone flagging you when you do something offensive... Talk about post modern thinking redefining truth. I at least hope you reported ME for flagging you, as it was me who did it.
If behavior fits a well known psychological condition, it is not a lie.
Calling people a liar is offensive. If you don't want to be flagged, do not call people names.
You have been reported to CP for flagging inappropriately. I will say it again. Daniel Paul, unless you are a psychologist, you do not have the authority to tell everyone that gays are codependent. It is a lie, and as a Christian you should strive for the truth. If your argument is secure, it will not need a lie such as the one you are spreading.
Mike, you calling people liars is just another example of you not wanting to accept truth. stop calling people liars.
The question then is raised if the children were truant. Unless this trip had the official OkeeDokee from the district then there's a problem.
Although the idea behind it may have been considered nice to people who came up with it...it left out many of the classmates did it not? In short, it was a field trip for a personal situation which was, at best, stretching what you can take a field trip for. They didn't go to witness the ceremony therefore they could have done the same thing at school when the teacher got back the same way the do with all other teachers getting married. Are they going to take a field trip everytime a teacher gets married? If not, doesn't that discriminate against straight people? How many teachers that have been married recently have had students allowed to come down and throw flower pedels?
The basis of the trip was for them to learn about the change in the law. They didn't witness this and nothing educational was accomplished which required a field trip. That day should count as an absence for each student the same way it would be an absence if Joe 5th Grader got taken to a family wedding.
I thought it was the gays that were complaining about a double standard.... There is a form of mental illness where the person who is portraying themselves as the victim is actually the one who is doing the vitimizing. Clearly this is manifestation of this in the gay community (and no...it's not just limited to gays and it is attached with codependency which every gay person I know myself suffers from).
"Apologies for the posting of a warning. I'm a newbie."
Most of us have done that at one time or another. You'll also find the site will do things by itself sometimes! This usually happens when you have typed a responce and you are just about ready to hit the submit button...then the page resets and you have to start all over!
gg, once again the only question I have is did all the parents who gave their children permission to go realize it was a same-sex ceremony or simply that their children's teacher was getting married?
gg, just because they used public transportation does not necessarily mean the school did not pay for it.
Apologies for the posting of a warning. I'm a newbie.
Anyway, the sfgate article:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/10/10/MNFG13F1VG.DTL
Hi folks. Signed on to deal with misconceptions on this story.
Parental consent: THIS WAS A PARENTAL IDEA. One of the kid's parents thought it would be nice if they could surprise her and congratulate her.
Expenses: The school did not provide transportation, if I read the sfgate article correctly. It was public transportation.
The ceremony: The kids didn't attend. They waited outside the courthouse to surprise her and throw rose petals.
The attitude: Two parents felt comfortable enough to keep their kids at school. One kid...wore a "No on Proposition 8" button.
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chicago, that's okay my son's already happily married!:)
"You will not be arrested and prosecuted for bringing children on a field trip without a parental permission slip"
Removing children from school property without permission is a no-no. Maybe your state is much more liberal than ours. Here, taking a child to a gay wedding could fall under 'contributing to the delinquency of a minor'. In fact, our law is written in such a way that having a child around someone who consistantly uses foul language is also contributing. The law actually lists it as an example.
State to state differences perhaps...but not rediculous. We still have morals and values here....
Believer: You're right, people have quite a few inconsistencies with regard to their prejudices.
If I had children, I, myself, would have a hard time if one of my children decided to marry a Republican.
Oh my gosh!
Daniel Paul, what a rediculous argument! You will not be arrested and prosecuted for bringing children on a field trip without a parental permission slip, and this field trip had a permission slip (which is why 2 parents chose to withhold their children from the trip.) If I brought my students off school property, really the worst that could happen is I get suspended without pay for a period of time.
A field trip without parents permission is a no-no. If there were no permission slips then the teacher should be arrested and procecuted.
Doing a field trip for this without doing a field trip for each side of the arguement is discrimination.
So much for gay marriage not harming anyone and being 'fair'.
chicago, and the real irony is my Mom and her family are 100% Portugese.
chicago, although probably a smaller percentage I personally know some blacks who would not have allowed their children to witness that type of wedding either. What's kind of comical is that I was stationed in Taiwan for two years back in the early 70s and if I would have come home with a Chinese wife everything would have been cool, but if I would have come home with a wife who was black or even Puerto Rican, talk about the fur flying!!!
chicago, I stand corrected and indeed you did not mention the Bible with regards to some Christians who would not have allowed their children to witness an interracial marriage and unfortunately you're correct with regards to that fact. Take care my friend.
Believer: I didn't say that there was anything against interracial marriages in the Bible. I said that 50 years ago, they were illegal in several states and that many Christians would not have tolerated letting their (white) children witness one.
( Science will back up that the intent to harm a child is a disorder.?)
God says it's a SIN.
As for the membership rolls of NAMBLA, "an undercover FBI investigation in 1995 discovered that there were 1,100 people on the rolls." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NAMBLA). This was before the explosion of the internet and homosexual activism had become so prevalent. I wonder what the membership numbers are today.
believer: Added to the HIV/AIDS, there is a high rate of depression/suicide. Also, they die much earlier than those who don't engage in homosexuality.
chicago, worldwide yes, but here in America HIV/AIDS is predominantly in the homosexual male community. In fact a little over a month ago I heard a spokesman from the homosexual community state that in the US AIDS is truly a gay problem and he went on to say that a large majority of those infected with HIV/AIDS are gay men.
chicago, please cite since no one else has the passages of Scripture used to oppose interracial marriages, because in reality there are none unless a person believes Jews are of only one color or Christians are only of one color.
ID4232: You missed my point. I was saying that 50 years ago, interracial marriage was illegal in several states and the majority of Christians in those states would not have tolerated letting their children observe an interracial wedding.
I was making the point that marriage laws change and so do the attitudes toward them.
Health problems with homosexuality? If you're referring to HIV/AIDS, the far majority of those with the disease are heterosexual. It's practically non-existent among lesbians. If we follow your logic, then heterosexual marriage should be illegal and only lesbians should be allowed to marry.
OK, I found the story. I wish Aaron Leichman would have cited it.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/10/11/MNFG13F1VG.DTL
To Chicago24
You would be wrong. It's a false analogy. Moses apparently married a black woman to which Aaron and Miriam objected, but God seems to have been fine with it. Comparing homosexuality with all the health problems that come with it, the clear teaching of the Bible about it, and the dismal history of it to interracial marriage or matters of race period is like comparing an apple to a peanut and saying they are the same because both are food. It makes no sense.
I'm suspicious of this story. What is the name of the school, from what district, and can someone point me to the original mentioned "reports"?
Jesus said of one who would cause a child to sin, it would be better for them if they were thrown in the sea with a milstone tied around their neck. These people are in for a very rude awakening one day - and then it will be too late.
ID4234: You said "The point is that the children were taken out of school to indoctrinate them towards a particular point of view which is contrary to the traditions of the country, the laws of most of the land, the desires of the majority of parents, and the one that really counts, The Holy Bible."
Fifty years ago, a number states prohibited interracial marriage. I'm sure that many "Christians" would have expressed your exact same viewpoint toward children seeing a black man marry a white woman.
believer, I wouldn't call them an abnormal community. That is the reality of their community, so they wanted their children to experience it. I can't imagine a school district allowing a field trip like that. In baltimore we need to have everything approved and fit into the curriculum.
Muggle, NAMBLA doesn't have chapters, they are only about 1,000 members large according to an undercover investigation. They are a filth and do not represent the entire community. Anyone who would want to harm children is clearly not in their right mind (and science will back up that the intent to molest a child is, in fact, a disorder.)
Here's a thought. How about a field trip to visit the local chapter of NAMBLA? That might be educational.
chicago, in any normal community I would say a hearty no way to parents wanting their children to witness this same-sex ceremony, but in San Francisco anything is possible, but as I said in an earlier post my sense is that many of these parents just saw where it was the wedding of their children's teacher and didn't even realize it was a same-sex ceremony, but once again it is San Francisco.