Interview: Legendary Bible Smuggler on Mideast Christian Converts and the Real Jihad
Brother Andrew, the legendary Dutch missionary who smuggled Bibles into communist countries during the Cold War, took time away from promoting his new book, Secret Believers: What Happens When Muslims Believe in Christ, at the Christian Booksellers Association's retailers convention in Atlanta last week to share with The Christian Post about the state of the Mideast church and what Christians worldwide can do to help fellow believers living in the hostile region.
The following are excerpts from the interview:
CP: What do you think is the most important thing Americans and Western Christians can learn from Mideast Christians? What can Mideast Christians learn from Western Christians?
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Brother Andrew: I think the ones that have to learn the most is us on how to hold onto faith in the face of persecution. We have lost that part because we have been spoiled by too much liberty and what we call democracy [to the point] that anything goes; even evil is often unpunished in our countries.
In their countries, the biggest evil is if you turn away from Islam and become a Christian. It's not bad to be an atheist but to follow Jesus Christ is a deadly sin there. We can learn from them more than they from us, but yet we still need each other.
I wish we can get a lot of encouragement and inspiration from their willingness to suffer for Jesus because that is a very important biblical term often used. We have forgotten it because we think in our society, 'Is there still need to suffer for Jesus?'' I say 'yes.'
CP: Is there any way to expand Christianity in the Middle East without bloodshed?
Brother Andrew: Of course there is. But again our source of information and our history is in the New Testament and there has never been an extension of the kingdom of God through revival or reformation without people willing to give up their life.
You use the word bloodshed and I don't really like that too much. But it is true if they cut your head off there is blood. It does happen. But we in our western way of thinking shy away from that kind of suffering because we think that the whole world should have liberty as we have. If that is true, then why don't we use the liberty we have to reach out to the world? If they use that liberty then they get into opposition, and opposition turns into persecution, and persecution turns into massacre. So that is their situation.
So how can we bring the two together? By knowing more about it, by getting involve and going there, and by putting more pressure on our governments to reach out through diplomatic ways to put more pressure on their government.
My cry in this book is more involvement, accepting responsibilities, getting there and talking, and still realizing if we lead people there to Jesus that they will be shunned by their societies and their family is honor-bound to kill them – that is the real situation and it is not going to go away.
CP: Some of the Muslim convert characters in your book see visions of a man dressed in white. Is it common for Muslim converts in the Middle East to see visions?
Brother Andrew: Yes, common in the sense it happens all over. I wouldn't say in big numbers but I know personally of several of them who probably never would have been reached by any Christians and God just revealed Himself in a vision or a dream or performing a tremendous healing, but that is only the initial contact they have with the Lord Jesus Christ.
Inevitably that sets them on a search to get to know Him. The search leads them to a person who can tell them more about Jesus, or give them the Scripture, or pray for them and help them grow in faith, because if faith is solely built on a vision or a dream then that is very weak faith. It is a great start but if you stay there with no follow-up and no Scripture and no fellowship and no prayer and no sacrament then they will still stay in their own Muslim traditions and they will never have a way to break out. So the presence of Christians is important and they have to get in touch with someone and that always happens.
CP: I read that there is a significant number of Christian converts that return to Islam? Why is that?
Brother Andrew: There is a tremendous movement of Christians towards Islam because of economic situation, marriage or forced marriages. Again the point is our lack of concern for Muslims who become Christians. Do we really see them as my brothers and my sisters in Jesus and I will do anything to help my children or brother if they have a problem?
Unless we learn that lesson of fellowship with the suffering and persecuted church, there is no hope for them. So in their isolation they may have second thoughts on why they let go of the relative security in the world of Islam, the protection they have from their tribe, clan and religion. If we do not reach out with encouragement – which is really important – then many will fall back.
CP: What do Mideast Christians need most from Christians worldwide?
Brother Andrew: The sense of fellowship that there is only one body of Christ – though we have different nationalities and cultures and denominations.
Also, we are talking now about 1.2 billion Muslims and how we can infiltrate their fellowship if we don't even know about them? So by getting to know them, we learn from them and they learn from us that there is only one body of Christ.
Therefore we must go there and say there is only one body of Christ. If we cannot do that as western Christians then we are admitting our inability to experience the power of God because God is the Lord of the universe. God loved the world. God let Jesus died for the whole world and if we accept any limitations we weaken our own faith in the power of God and deny them the chance to become Christians and therefore let them – this might sound rude, but – continue in their misery which can lead to terrorism, for instance.
There is no way out. Though they are taught there is a way out, 'but it is going to cost us our lives.'
That is why it is so imperative that we reach out and go there with one message – not the western message or the western lifestyle – but the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
CP: What are Muslims in the Middle East taught about the Western world that caused them to have such a negative view of us?
Brother Andrew: What they think is mainly negative but what they want from the West is of course Coca-cola, the technology and computers. What they see on television Hollywood-style is exposing our way of life which they deeply resent. I think the main reason for their aggressive action and attitude towards us is their protest against our lifestyle.
Why should they be offended? Because it is being exported by the people who go there, the businesses we conduct there and when they switch on television and they can watch through the internet and website or when they visit our countries they see the immodest way of dress and the loose way of living and they say we don't want this because we want to keep Islam pure.
I think that is a very good motive in itself and we should really take this into account that they have a reason, which we might not agree with, but they attack us because they feel we are exporting our wrong immoral lifestyle to their close, puritan society. That is why they fight more than anything political or religious it is the lifestyle issue. It is within our power here to change it and not because of their pressure but because of the demand of our holy God.
CP: Why do you invite Christians in your new book to join you in the "good jihad?" Is this an appropriate use of the word given almost all non-Muslims are so fearful of the term?
Brother Andrew: I don't use that term too much publicly when I'm in the Middle East. It is literally quoting from the Bible because Paul said 'I fought the good fight' and in the Arab Bible it says 'I fought the good jihad.'
Everybody there is aware of the concept of the two jihads – the real jihad they say is the one you fight with your heart to follow the decrees of Allah and the rules of the Koran. The other jihad corresponds with things like 9/11, but that is only for the few that do that.
I think we have to distinguish between the jihad of extremists and fundamentalists which is only a small part of the Muslims and the good jihad which all of them and us have to fight – against sin and self. That is why we use the word jihad.
CP: What message or thought do you most want your reader to carry away with them after reading your book?
Brother Andrew: There is a church in those countries and that our first reaction when we see something terrible happen – whether it be an earthquake, a tsunami, or bombs dropping or insurgencies or other acts of terrorism – the first question should be if there is a church. That is what I want every Christian to think.
Second, is 'what can I do for God's children there?' And the third is that people who read and hear me will get in touch with the people described in that book by getting onto our website www.secretbelievers.org and getting all the instructions they need, including linking up with churches and Christians there. That is the best way we can encourage them and keep in touch.
